Former President Barack Obama explained his reasoning that more men need queer friends. As a guest on his wife Michelle Obama‘s IMO podcast, which she hosts with her brother Craig Robinson, the 63-year-old detailed his experience with a gay male mentor and emphasized the importance of having diverse friend groups.
“One of the most valuable things I learned as a guy was, I had a gay professor in college at a time when openly gay folks still weren’t out,” reflected Obama. “Who became one of my favorite professors and was a great guy, and would call me out when I started saying stuff that was ignorant.”
The father of two continued, “You need that to show empathy and kindness. And by the way, you need that person in your friend group so that if you then have a boy who’s gay, or non-binary, or what have you…they have somebody that they can go, ‘Okay, I’m not alone in this.’’ That, I think, is creating community. I know it’s corny, but it’s what they need.”
In the same podcast episode, Barack Obama also explained why it would have been “difficult” to raise a son.
“I think we did a pretty good job of raising our girls, but I’ve said often that I think I would have had more difficulty raising a son,” he said as the former First Lady agreed.
“I think I might’ve been more judgmental, harder,” he added, before reflecting on his upbringing without a male role model in his life. “I would’ve tried to—I’d like to think I would have been more self-aware enough to combat that. But I just think father-son relationships, for me, particularly if I don’t have a dad around to show it to me, might’ve been more difficult.”
Michelle Obama and Craig Robinson launched IMO earlier this year. According to its website, “This podcast will leave you laughing, reflecting, and feeling more prepared to tackle life’s challenges.”
Past episodes have featured Taraji P. Henson, Keke Palmer, Dr. Laurie Santos, Seth and Lauren Rogan, and Issa Rae. Watch the full episode featuring Barack Obama above.